Welcome to the latest Roundtable discussion here at iFight365.com where this week, we’re asking the question: In the light of Gabe Sapolsky’s recent departure, what steps would you take to shake things up in ROH?

Mark Bright: As big a fan as I was of ROH for many years, over the past 12 months or so the product had got very stale, and is in definite need of a shakeup. Being from the UK rather than being from New York or Chicago or Dayton or Philadelphia I can’t comment with personal experience of what their live shows have been like besides the two UK shows I’ve gone to, the last of those being more than 18 months ago, but from what you hear reading online it appears to be that the shows are considered to be too long, and even things like intermission going 30 minutes plus mean that you’re in the building for a ridiculously long time. So the first change I would make would be to cut down the length of the shows, maybe limit them to 7 matches on a card, sometimes even less if you’re having a longish match in the main event.

Watching on DVD, I know the whole “pro wrestling as a sport” thing was a unique selling point for ROH when the company started, but that was 2002. I am so fucking tired of matches that mean nothing other than throwing two guys out there for no reason whatsoever. Like on Vendetta II which I’ve just watched, Erik Stevens, who is a babyface coming off a big win over Bryan Danielson the previous night and at the end of a hardcore blood feud with Roderick Strong, wrestled Jay Briscoe, a babyface tag team wrestler who is in the middle of a violent crazy blood feud with heel group The Age Of The Fall, who injured his brother and tag team partner Mark. Stevens and Briscoe had no reason for having a match, they are in completely seperate feuds, they’re both babyfaces, and in the match they worked an even paced double babyface back and forth match that just fucking sucked. Neither guy did anything to draw me into the match, I had no reason to care whether one guy won or lost, it was just guys going out there doing moves for no reason. And ROH has at least one, and most of the time 2 or 3 of those matches on the same show. So get rid of those, if two guys are left over with nothing else for them on the card, leave them off the fucking show.

Also, in the matches, the “WrestleMania finishes” in five or six different matches on the show are just overkill. If you’ve got a well built up main event where people actually care about who wins or loses adn the result has a major effect on the company then it works. If you’re building one guy up to the main event, him kicking out of a bunch of finishers from the main eventer is a good thing. They did this brilliantly with Tyler Black and his match with Nigel McGuiness at the Take No Prisoners PPV. Tyler is a future star and someone that can carry the company, so that’s all good, but Black getting that superpush works, but the effectiveness of it is neutered because he did the same thing with guys like Kevin Steen who, as improved as he has been this year, isn’t going to be carrying the company. I don’t see a problem with the champion getting dominant wins and proving that he’s better than lower card challengers, the 50/50 booking of every match really annoys me and doesn’t help anybody get over as stars.

I also hate the “lets hit each other really hard” stuff that came from Gabe’s wanking over anything Japanese. OK so Kenta Kobashi hits people really hard, but that’s not why he got over, he became a star because of his great natural charisma, incredible facials and ability to put together epic main event matches. Seeing a clown like Erik Stevens or Go Shiozaki or even Low Ki get pushed based on absolutely nothing other than “look how hard he hits” is retarded. Wrestling is a WORK, learn to throw some fucking punches. Chops are essentially just an excuse to make the crowd go “WOOOOOOOOO” anyway, and the crowd would do that if you give someoene a poke to the eye or do a strut or attempt a figure four leglock, and you’d get that same reaction without hurting your opponent and yourself. Forearm strikes look like SHIT, I can honestly say in 17 years of watching wrestling I’ve never seen a forearm strike look good. Watch some Jerry Lawler, watch some Shawn Michaels, watch some Matt Hardy, learn to fucking punch properly.

The use of local guys on more recent shows is a positive step for me. But I’d use them like old TV jobbers from the pre-Nitro era of wrestling. Instead of Erik Stevens following up his big win over Danielson by having a boring as hell 50/50 match with Jay Briscoe, stick him in there with local Joe Schmoe and hit his trademark spots and get a dominant win in 3 minutes. Instead of Nigel McGuiness doing a 20-minute title defense against a midcarder the night before he’s scheduled to defend against a top guy, so everybody knows there’s no title change, have Nigel take on a jobber and beat him quickly, maybe even using the finisher of his opponent the next night.

Simple basic booking, clearly defined babyfaces and heels, less 50/50 matches, no four corner survivals although that’s just personal choice because I hate them and it’s just an excuse to get more guys on the card, don’t do the big finisher exchange on every match on the card. That’s what i’d do, and to be honest lots of it is similar to some of the things Adam Pearce is rumoured to be doing so i’m very interested in when the DVDs start coming out of new ROH.

Martin Smith: There’s a few things. First of all, a look at the talent. Now personally, if I went into ROH, I honest to God wouldn’t give a damn what they’ve done before. We can talk about Joe’s title run, Punk being there and more. But this is my show now and all that goes into the archives in the past.

I’d bring in some old-school names. The likes of Paul London, Stevie Richards, Johnny Devine, Balls Mahoney, Matt Bentley and more. There needs to be name on that card that a neutral wrestling fan will want to see. I’d keep the underground feel but I’d make it my show. Bringing back Samoa Joe every now and then isn’t the way forward in my eyes. Get guys in who will work consistently. Get guys in who will dedicate themselves to your show. This is what has always annoyed me with ROH. They’ve had talented guys and not signed them up. Sign them up and get making a name for yourself.

Next off, the show would be built around a solid backbone. The likes of Aries, Danielson, Strong spring to mind. Don’t bring over the Japanese guys. I, for one, don’t want to see part-timers. Bring them in as an attraction for a big event, but build the show around the talent you know will work every month non-stop.

I would ditch this stupid “code of honor” crap and make the programme a bit more risky. The likes of Mahoney can provide a few hardcore matches and breakaway from the traditional stuff they’ve been doing.

It would all need consistency but I think it would work well. Keep the high flying matches and the technical classics, but add a bit of risk, a few more recognisable faces, a few interesting storylines and a roster that are tied up to contracts.

If you look at some of the names who have been through the doors of ROH and ended up in TNA or WWE, it is remarkable. This is one thing that would stop straightaway.

Michael Campbell: Well, it seems that first shots have been fired as so far as “shaking things up” is concerned. And it seems to me, hat they’re trying to change a few things here and there, but make as little noise about it as possible.

Smart fans are the best and the worst of fans In my opinion. If you’ve seen some of the anal rants about the ROH product on their own message board, you’ll know what I mean. ROH needs to not completely polarise them with a new “direction” and the first two shows that took place in Canada, indicate to me that they’re going to change things up at their own pace and gradually make the product more palatable for all-round consumption.

They’ve already introduced count-outs, which previously didn’t exist in ROH. I think this is a great move, as it opens up a whole bunch of storyline possibilities. I’ve also heard that the two shows in Canada were much more streamlined, with less overkill in the early matches, that made for a more satisfying whole. Again, I’m all for this, as I agree that there’s no need for the guys to be going all out in every bout and much can be said for the WWE’s “big top” circus philosophy.

If ROH wants to end up on TV, they’ll have to provide a product that the majority can understand and follow, without insulting the current fans…a tough balance. If I were in charge, I’d completely cut out the Japanese imports, save for three or four big shows a year. Having say GO, around full-time is fine, if he’s the only one and his act is individual enough. For me it isn’t and I’d rather have Morishima, Shingo, Doi, Nakijima, Ibushi, Marufuji, or KENTA, even Ishimori around. Kensuke Sasaki may be NOAH Champion, but his appearances in ROH have done nothing and have been eclipsed by excitement over the matches Bryan Danielson, their own talent, has been signed for on the same cards.

I’d also stop booking guys like Eddie Edwards (who I actually really like), but most fans take him, and his ilk, as a Randy Orton look-a-like who watches too much Puro. I’d get rid of Ruckus, and anyone else who fans can see a better version of elsewhere.

What they’re going to do about PPV’s is anybody’s guess though .They aren’t well enough supported by their supposed “hardcore” fans, and those who follow on DVD are thrown out of continuity somewhat and frustrated by the release schedules. A big improvement on presentation would help. Actually paying someone decent to throw together some quality build-up packages and video segments distinguishes the pros from the XPWs.

Backstage skits need a lot of work too. I think it was the Rising Above one (An otherwise GREAT show) had Age of the Fall members randomly walking around backstage In some of the most horrible segments I’ve ever seen. The highpoint of all this nonsense was Necro Butcher attacking someone with A PLANT (although again, anyone experiencing ROH for the first time may have fled at this point).

In general though, the product itself was never a problem for the company and I agree with Dave Meltzer, in saying that it didn’t need to change as such. Modifications, yes (less chop-fests, simpler undercards etc). But a loss of identity, no sir. Thus, their real problems remain a pre-historic website, poor exposure, fans unwilling to shell out ten bucks for a fantastic two-hour show, a general lack of buzz around wrestling and production values that should have improved more than they have over six years.

I could go on. There’s so much to consider in terms of ROH and it’s future, but I’m pretty burnt out talking about it. I suggest we all continue to support it, while the new directions (which to be fair, aren’t crazy-different) are allowed to find their feet.

Oh yeah, and I’d give Jigsaw his mask back. Actually no, he’s one of the guys I’d cut. Sorry dude.

Phil Lowe: The reaction to Gabe leaving and Adam Pearce being named booker was met on the ROH message boards with similar reaction to Brock Lesnar’s win at the weekend was on the Sherdog forwards, and my first suggestion would likely get the same reaction. But I’d also make shows more about the storylines and (dirty word alert) entertainment rather than focusing on a card full of shit-hot wrestling matches. Having a 5-star main event match is great for any wrestling promotion. But doing it on a card where everybody is out to achieve the same goal results in the fans burning out.

I guess a lot of how you answer this question depends on what goals Cary Silkin and ROH have set out for the next year or two. For me, if I owned ROH right now my main goal would be a television deal. And for that, you have to look at the entertainment aspects more and more. That obviously will mean you upset a bunch of smarky fans, but so be it.

I’d also drop foreign talent completely - even for the big shows. There’s enough available talent in the U.S for Adam Pearce and the post-Gabe ROH team to create new, interesting matches and storylines. The Japanese guys, although talented, come over at a cost and that money could be better used elsewhere. Production values, for starters.

Forget about using former ROH regulars who are now in TNA. Yes, even Samoa Joe. I’m not a fan of the likes of Joe returning for one show here and there. TNA will always want to protect their own interests and for ROH, to me it comes across as “look at how we used to be.” Look to the future and if you have to bring in outsiders from time to time, use a guy who isn’t under contract to anybody and have him come in to elevate your own guys.

James Mustoe: Well Nigel Mcguiness has certainly worked as a heel champion so I wouldn’t want to change anything as far as the head person for the promotion goes. What I would do however, at least for the short term, is hire recent WWE-release Paul London, who enjoyed a fantastic run in ROH from 2002-03, and push him as a main eventer as soon as possible.

While London hadn’t been used on WWE television for quite some time, he crucially has not been jobbed out and the typical smart fan of ROH would probably remember his previous indy work and respect him on those merits. London has fresh match ups with virtually all of ROH’s current roster and I’m sure no one would begrudge a rerun of his awesome little series with Brain Danielson from his previous stay.

In the long term I would probably cut down on the international fly-ins, apart from a couple of shows a year, as they would probably draw better as special attractions. In their place I would place more of an emphasis on using other American Independent talent, particularly from PWG and CHIKARA. Guys like Mike Quackenbush deserve much more of a push from ROH than what they have previously received and an influx of new faces would go a long way to break the holding pattern that ROH seems to have been in for the majority of this year’s shows.